That Atheist Blog

tribals are the original setlers of india called Adivasis

Adivasis? Interesting! I'm going to read more about that - thank you for the comment!

Sorry, but yes, the United States of America was most certainly founded upon the ideals of the Judeo-Christian beliefs. The indigenous population did not write our Constitution, battle Europe for our independence nor contribute to our Bill of Rights. Our countries founders were surely influenced by the Bible and it's tenets of freedom, responsibility and brotherhood.

@Ivor - I respectfully submit for your perusal The Constitution was an attempt to strictly limit the power of government and protect the unalienable rights of individuals under Natural Law. The experiment failed of course, but that was the original intent. The principle philosophical influences of the Founding Fathers were John Locke and Algernon Sidney.

Structurally though, there are aspects of the government that were based on the Roman system and on Mosaic law.

But the Constitution was most certainly not founded on the Christian religion:

"The Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion" - George Washington. George would know, he was there.

That's an interesting view Radical. :)

I disagree! The United States forced the Native Americans almost into extinction! We were here long before the white man came. We opened our hearts to them! They repaid us in kind by forcing their values upon the Indian nations, taking away our lands, and those of us which refused to listen to them they hunted us into extinction along with the buffalo.

Although we still live among you, we still remember! " The United States of America was most certainly founded upon the ideals of the Judea-Christian beliefs", This is a lie! Those which they could not reform to Christians were forced off the land or hunted and placed on reservations and left to starve and die of sickness. This is my humble opinion...

...and don't forget those cool small pox laden blankets they gave some tribes to hurry up their demise.

Michael, I've lived within 100 miles of a rez for my entire life, wherever I've lived. Thanks to recent changes in Oglala Nation enrollment rules, my kids just became eligible for enrollment in the tribe. Having said that, I can now say this... Horse shit. You are talking about the same thing these Indians around here have been talking about my entire life. Anyone that "oppressed" them are dead now. Indians can go ahead and live wherever they want. No one is oppressing them now. In fact Title VII of Civil Rights Act of 1964 guarantees that they are not being oppressed in the work environment. So let's talk about who is oppressing them now. So the Oglala Rez that I live 50 miles up the road from one of the most violent reservations in America. 1/2 of all the movies about Indians came out in the last 20 years were made on or connected to that rez, so there's an income potential. It seems like everyone wants to know where Wounded Knee is, it's on the rez too, so they have some tourism. And it is a dry rez, but somehow a town 24 people two miles over the state border from the rez happened to go through 4.6 million cans of beer in 2008. I think I was in or just got out of high school when the movie Incident at Oglala came out, and talked about AIM and the fact that that rez had the highest murder rate per capita of anywhere in the US. There are always cases of embezzlement that make the news, corruption in the tribal council, etc. And as a white guy knowing what I know, of the 4 times I've ventured there, I took at least 1 gun each time and made sure I had a full tank of gas. We aren't talking about some third-world country, we're talking about right in the middle of America. The northside of the city I live in, where most of the Indians live... is where most of the murders around here occur, most of the property crimes, etc. I've heard this whole "oppression" argument my entire life, and I have yet to prevent an Indian from voting, I have yet to prevent an Indian from going to school, work, or do anything else they want to do. NOW they prevent themselves. Most of the crimes are not White vs. Indians, it's Indians vs. Indians.

Granted my view is skewed because of the rezs around here and the people on them. In the course of American history, the Sioux have been one of the most violent tribes, instead of gathering nuts and berries, they'd wait from someone to gather the nuts and berries then raid them and steal the nuts and berries. Oh sure they hunted buffalo and deer, but they didn't grow any crops. I have been to rezs in at least 20 different states from California to the east coast, and I am amazed that I am actually on a rez. The people speak proper English, don't say "ennit" every other word, don't call each other "fucker-bitches" and they aren't stumbling around waiting for their weekly ride to detox. I've seen rezs that don't have dead animals laying in the ditch to the point where they are bones and hide. I've seen rezs out there that are worse than the one 50 miles up the road, and it all comes down to the fact that these people do it to themselves by drinking and watching life go by, blaming me... a 36 year-old white man... who's grandparents weren't even thought of when they were being herded to boarding schools. There are opportunities out there and they are legally protected, including the right to religion. They have sweatlodges even some places in town here, and sundances down on the rez, so they can worship whoever they want. BTW 1 in 10 people in the state are Indian, they aren't being forced into extinction.

@ The Smartest Angel... Thank you for your follow up and response to my comment! We were discussing the past and not the future...

Man those 24 people in that town a few miles over must be alcoholics!

Great comment...Lol

Jo... Ever seen the movie Skins? That would be the place.

Seriously? How cool to know!

maybe...

Should the sins of a father fall on the son in any religion?
Does the great spirit show us that each new life is of its own a gift from him to him that we should not steal the past from previous generations. Yet all things good and bad from the past are a gift from the great spirit that we may learn wisdom to have understanding that we are all connected. The hurt of one hurts us all.

Aho!

@Mat hey stop spewing your "stuff". And yes there are TONS of contradictions in the bible - but you have to tell me which version you use and I'll be happy to give them to you.
2 last things - please learn where your caps lock is and turn that sucker OFF and understand no one is trying to "bring down" anything. Okay? Okay!

Okey. ^_^

please be happy to give me jolynn, ^_^
can u site some, that u think is a contradiction in the bible.
King James Version will be fine.

Thank you very much. ^_^

my apologies. i just got carried away because l firmly believe that their is no contradiction in the Bilble. This is because our Father in heaven is the God Almighty and the creator of heaven and earth. God cannot lie, God will not deny Himself. So, their must be fairness in the posting of information. And the bilble is the reference.

Thank you again;
In Christ Jesus. ^_^

@Mat - I am sorry, I didn't know you had posted. The bible is FILLED with contradictions and incorrect information (the world is flat, the bat is a bird, the sun revolves around the earth....etc).

Here is a list of biblical contradictions you may peruse at your own leisure:
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/jim_meritt/bible-contradictions.html
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/donald_morgan/inconsistencies.html
http://www.evilbible.com/Biblical%20Contradictions.htm
http://www.atheists.org/Biblical_Contradictions
Those oughta keep you busy for a while.
Happy reading!

@ jolynn: this is self-serving, why would i go to those site when the explanations is based on their own understanding. the bible is the reference and has no contradictions, if u can use it correctly. you should give me what book, chapter and verses you are saying that u dont understand and what you think is contradicting to you. i bet you did'nt read the bible, because you ask me what version and i said king james version will be fine. so, start reading the bible and tell me what book, chapter and verses is contradicting to u. Happy reading! ^_^

@Mat - I'm not really certain how clicking a link is self serving but if you feel it is - so be it. I have hundreds of contradictions in the Bible to choose from - here are a few - happy reading back at cha.

War or Peace?
EXO 15:3 The LORD is a man of war: the LORD is his name.
ROM 15:33 Now the God of peace be with you all. Amen.

Who is the father of Joseph?
MAT 1:16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.
LUK 3:23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli.

Is Jesus equal to or lesser than?
JOH 10:30 I and my Father are one.
JOH 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.

Which first--beasts or man?
GEN 1:25 And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
GEN 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

GEN 2:18 And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.
GEN 2:19 And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.

The number of beasts in the ark

GEN 7:2 Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female.

GEN 7:8 Of clean beasts, and of beasts that are not clean, and of fowls, and of every thing that creepeth upon the earth, GEN 7:9 There went in two and two unto Noah into the ark, the male and the female, as God had commanded Noah.

Is it folly to be wise or not?
PRO 4:7 Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding.

ECC 1:18 For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow.

1CO 1:19: "For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent."

Righteous live?
PSA 92:12: "The righteous shall flourish like the palm tree."

ISA 57:1: "The righteous perisheth, and no man layeth it to heart."



CRUEL, UNMERCIFUL, DESTRUCTIVE, and FEROCIOUS or KIND, MERCIFUL, and GOOD:

"I will not pity, nor spare, nor have mercy, but destroy." (JER 13:14) "Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not, but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling."

"The Lord is very pitiful and of tender mercy." (JAS 5:11)
"For his mercy endureth forever." (1CH 16:34)
"The Lord is good to all, and his tender mercies are over all his works." (PSA 145:9)
"God is love." (1JO 4:16)

@jolynn: still u did'nt read the bible, what u have, is just a copy and post. they dont know how to use the bible correctly. from what u copy and posted as an example:
War or Peace?
EXO 15:3 The LORD is a man of war: the LORD is his name.
if u just continue reading the bible,
EXO 15:4-6 -it is to destroy the enemy from egypt.
while:
ROM 15:33 Now the God of peace be with you all. Amen.
if u just read the bible,
ROM 15:30-32 -it is a greetings for the brethrens by apostle paul.
so, where is d contradiction?

the following, which u just copy and post r just misleading readers because u really did not read the bible and u dont have any idea where this books, chapters and verses are located within the bible. u have a responsibility for that. to know the truth. to test it, if its true or not by reading the bible.
start reading the bible and then tell me what book, chapter and verse u dont understand or has contradiction to u personally that u have already red. here is a guide on how to read the bible : Colossians 2:8 and Isaah 34:16. and their is no contradictions or what so ever in the bible, if u just read and know how to use the bible correctly.
happy reading and may God bless u and guide u to read the bible. ^_^

@Mat - Yes, I get your strategy, no matter what example I put up or how many you're going to refute with "you don't know how to use the bible correctly" simple because I'm not agreeing with you. I have read not only KJV but many versions for comparison.
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To reuse my own example, the contradiction is that Exo15:3 clearly says the lord is a man of WAR. Then in Rom 15:33 he clearly says he is a God of Peace...
Isn't that just a tad bipolar?
In my opinion, the Bible is a violent Bronze age book written by primitive men and its outdated ideas (slavery, war, women being submissive...Etc...)have no place in a modern society.
We would be much more advanced as humans without religion holding us back. Look at how much strife it has caused? And why are there 33,000 brands of Christianity if there is only one God - shouldn't an all powerful being have the ability to convey what He wants taken as his word? The answer is - God is Imaginary and he can't. Religion is man made, just like God.

jolynn show me where in the bible it showe these : (the world is flat, the bat is a bird, the sun revolves around the earth....etc).

vixen

i am praying for you, jolynn 3am art. you need to open your eyes to THE WORD. you dont want to be found unsaved when THE LORD JESUS comes back for his own. hell is not a place you want to end up.
i know you have tried to use my name against me, but what is past is pat. christians are not perfect, just forgiven.
you need to open your eyes to what "mat mateo" is saying...read the bible with an open mind.
yes religion is man made and bad, very bad things have been done in the name of religion. but true christianity isnt a religion, it is a relationship.

@Vixen - If you're talking about me laughing at your screen handle..well you chose the name you use.... and if you're going to pray for me, I will continue to hope your mental functions return to normal when you stop praying. I don't want to be a Christian - sort of rude for you to assume so. I don't want a relationship with an imaginary being - I gave that stuff up when I was 4 yrs old.

Vixen - Leviticus 11:19 for the bat is a bird, as far as the earth being flat - here you go : Isaiah 11:12, Revelation 7:1, Job 38:13, Jeremiah 16:19, Daniel 4:11- all of those passages talk about the corners and ends of the earth - a sphere does not have corners or an end.
Those are just bad facts basically because the bible was written during a scientifically primitive time, but one would think an all knowing, intelligent being could convey how things really were.

jolynn ... as far as the ends of the earth and the four corners, we still use such terms today; does that make us primative, as well? and many people today still call a bbat a bird.
as for assuming you want to be a christian...i was hopeing, not assuming. i never assume anything.
the only imaginary being i see here is you. for we are all dust on the wind and gone in an instant.
i have many of these same talks with members of my family so you are not unusual to me. but you sound somewhat smart, so one can only hope you will wise up.to bad you were smarter at 4 than you are now.

@Vixen - People who make statements that perceive the earth is flat and call a bat a bird are sadly uneducated. People who believe in imaginary beings maybe should be looking at many sides of that equation and asking some hard questions about what they are told to believe. Good try at being peremptory. :)

@jolynn: ur example, u do the analysis. its not a strategy, it how to use the bible correctly. ^_^

To reuse my own example, the contradiction is that Exo15:3 clearly says the lord is a man of WAR.
But to whom is the Lord a man of war? To the enemy of israelites. the soldiers of egypt(paroah) who worship idols and dont believe in God. (pls. read Exo 15:3-6)
while
Then in Rom 15:33 he clearly says he is a God of Peace...(pls. read Rom 15:30-33)
Apostle Paul said this as a greetings or as a regards for the brethrens.
it has no contradiction because it tells 2 different story and context, for whom the verses are independent from one another.

sugar analogy: Ex1. sugar is very bad for severe diabetic patients.
Ex2. sugar is very good for sweet delights, cakes, & pastries.
now, it is clearly said sugar is bad in Ex1. then in Ex2. sugar is very good. but what to consider is why the sugar is bad and good. u mean to say their is a contradiction in sugar? it tells 2 different story and context, for why the sugar is bad and good. get the picture.
so, in the example that we are analyzing. by parallelism, it is CLEARLY SAID and u just stop at Ex1. sugar is very bad then in Ex2. sugar is very good. Isn't that just a tad bipolar?

you fix your reading to that, so, you must reconsider to continue reading in its full messege.
to read the whole messege of Exo15:3 you must read it Exo 15:3-6 and to read the whole messege of Rom 15:33 you must read it Rom 15:30-33. these verses are independent from one another and has different meanings to whom it was used.
so again, their is no contradiction.
happy reading! ^_^

@Mat- Your excuses are very common ones in defense of the bible.
I did read the whole message but as I wrote previously, you are a hardcore believer, I am not trying to dissuade you from that however futile I may personally feel that belief is. But yes there are contradictions and yes God appears very bipolar in my layman's opinion.
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Any book that would promote slavery, suppression of women, infanticide, genocide, patricide and the maiming of humans (take a stroll through Deuteronomy for that one) has no place in modern society.

@jolynn: smile. ^_^
so, lets just say that your layman's opinion is God appears very bipolar and that the bible has contradiction.
while
im a hardcore believer of God and the bible has no contradiction according to my common sense. ^_^
lets just leave it that way. so thier is no contradiction. okey. ^_^

i thank you for giving me the chance to explain my side. if you dont believe in God, it is fine. because God believes in you. -its just my belief. just do what you think is for good in your heart and that will be fine.
take care always
mat ^_^

@jolynn: smile. ^_^
Your excuses are very common ones in defense of the bible.
you are correct jolynn, my analogy is very common. my apologies.
"I did read the whole message" - you red it as you said. then you shifted-out of our specific topic. and said "but as I wrote previously, you are a hardcore believer, etc..."
as if you are evading to explain what you red.
did you understand the whole messege?
are they independent with one another?
are their context different with one another?
are those verses tell 2 different story?
Exo 15:3-6
Rom 15:30-33
again, their is no contradiction.

take care always
mat ^_^

@mat- It is impossible to evade explaining the imaginary. LOL.... Absolutely there IS a contradiction. But you can add all the meanings you need all day long if it makes you feel better.

very nice article..thanx for sharing this with all..

@jolynn: smile. ^_^
It is impossible to evade explaining the imaginary. LOL...
jolynn, Exo 15:3-6 and Rom 15:30-33 are not imaginary, it is written, in fact you said: "I did read the whole message" , remember, hehehe ^_^
while
But you can add all the meanings you need all day long if it makes you feel better.
i agree with this. so, their is no contradiction. okey. ^_^

just do what you think is for the good, deep in your heart, and that will be fine.

take care always
mat ^_^

@Mat - you too!

whether Christian or Not, Believing in God is the only way and life without Him is a totally disaster.
The only way a nation is Blessed is by believing in God. Read your Bible

@JoLynn - MARK 16 : 9-20 is not true, its not in the original Greek Bible, l used this as a good reference and also the Codec Siniticus Bible.

take care always
mat ^_^

@Mat why not go back to original first Hebrew translations that Eusebius Pamphili used in compilations? You know where he chose what books to leave out in order to further the overall goal of control of the Bible? The post was about the country being founded on top of people who were already in what would become the United States and they weren't Christians.

@Dolores - I have read the Bible - many versions in fact, that's why I am an atheist.

@Colin - exactly - but what you caught there was me answering someone who made an off topic comment on this post. And believe me, I'm not asking you or anyone else to not believe in a God or an afterlife. I just personally don't see the logic of believing in something without basis in fact. Thanks for your thoughts Colin - they are always welcome.